In this space you will find a survey with young dancers that I introduced to the collection of objects, a talk with Hip Hop scholar Jur Bouterse who I approached as an expert of the culture, a talk with urban dance based choreographer Takao Baba to get a perspective on choreography and an interview with Célestine Hennermann, who I asked for insights as a dramaturg in urban dance based productions.
The interviews are transcribed in a way that they contain mostly information that is relevant for my research and adress topics that were meaningful for my process.
You can click the links to jump between the interviews and the survey or just scroll through the page.
Enjoy reading!
interview with Célestine Hennermann
Survey with JDC @ EinTanzHaus
In order to try out and develop my toolbox of objects with other people I took the opportunity to teach it to the young dancers of Junior Dance Company @ EinTanzHaus in Mannheim, Germany. All of the classes were taught online.
I hoped to not only gain insights for my research. My goal was also to make them independent dancers that could create choreographies themselves.
In times of Covid-19 it was not possible to meet in person and my toolbox of objects helped to facilitate a space for exploration where bodily sensations could transcend the screen.
Here are some reactions to a survey that some of the dancers filled in:
Talk with Jur Jurskee Bouterse
In the talk with Jur, a dancer, organizer, moderator, teacher, researcher and philospher in the field of Hip Hop and Breaking, I wanted to get an inside perspective of the culture and hear the perspective of an expert in this field. Although this conversation was more extensive I made choices of what would be relevant for this research. There was not really a Q&A structure in our talk. I paraphrased Jur this way to make it more readable.
The essence of Breaking:
The title of the movie Stylewars says it all: we're leading a battle on based on style.
Can you talk about BOTY (Battle of the Year) and it’s impact on Breaking and how its choreographed?
BOTY determined the way Beaking is choreographed. BOTY has a catalogue of criteria that are judged. According to those criteria the best shows get picked, which means that the best four qualify for the battle. The format of this event comes with the problem of being accepted within the scene if you’re not a hardcore battle crew or person.
BOTY serves as an example of a transition from an event for participants to an event for audience.
It supports collaboration because it demands to create a show together in order to be able to participate.
How is Breaking organized?
It is has a bottom up hierarchy, not top down. It is a low threshold activity where you chose your moves, your fashion, it comes from inside out. That can lead to conflicts when dealing with authorities. E.g. Amsterdam categorizes urban as unorganized or differently organized sport.
How do you see the development of choreography that includes urban dancers?
In France some of the first generation dancers kept dancing and became choreographers. They understood well how to translate the artform from the street to the stage. In the Netherlands it was always interesting to do crossovers: keep the street out but use its movement repertoire.
Any tips on making choreography with urban dancers?
If you want to let a street dancer shine on stage you have don’t have to make movement material for them, you have to direct Them. They needs their moment and get the opportunity to let it all out. In the rehearsals you have to search for a different approach as well. Otherwise you will never learn what someone can do.
Also give time to search for the right environment to create. Maybe you put a spot and create a club atmosphere… Whatever you do let the potential of your dancers emerge!
And ask questions: What personal ideas did you add to the movement? What is your musicality? How many layers does your dance have?
What does Breaking need to flourish?
Breaking doesn’t need much. It needs a space and some music. Everything also comes from within.
How do we name what we do?
Language is very intuitive. We know already what it is and afterwards we put language to it.
Where did Hip Hop start and where is it now?
All elements of Hip Hop were in its origin rebels. That’s why it was hard that these artforms were accepted in society. Because they went against the status quo.
Nowadays the division between underground and mainstream is decreasing. We’re established. Everybody heard of it. They might not know about recent developments — but they heard of it.
The danger of being established is that it might lose its interest for the newer generations. It already took 40 years to get it to where it is now. That means that nowadays kids are born after Breaking was born. So they might call it outdated or say to their parents that it is something from their generation. Not something for them.
Any last words?
You can kick us out but we’ll sprout back like weed!
Interview with Célestine Hennermann
Célestine is a freelance dramaturg and choreographer based in Frankfurt/Main. She started her career with the Forsythe Company, did the dramaturgy for various productions with urban dancers and has her own company Hennermann’s Horde with which she produces pieces for young audience. This talk happened in spring 2020 before the actual start of this research. We talked about different topics around urban dance based choreography. I took it into this exposition because of its relevance to the topic.
First was the distinction between show and stage work: The most identifiable principle of a show according to her is the frontal orientation. In order to bring a change to that Célestine worked to establish different lines in space with the dancers and through that create different relationships.
Transitioning between different motifs was a big field of investigation. Célestine described that the urban dancers were often constructing the piece out of different acts that they put in an order. To connect these different elements more elaborately appeared to be difficult. She also described that certain tricks were put in the performance in order to show them off. To contextualize them and to give them a meaning was tricky. Also sometimes the urban dancers tended to have an approach to performing that could be better placed in a circus context. Which then might have a negative connotation in the theatre world.
What also came with difficulties in the work with the urban dancers was to work with a topic or on a conceptual base to develop material. Whereas in contemporary dance it is sometimes very conceptual in urban dance it is not done so much. There are plenty of concepts to generate movement. But there are not so many concepts of how to contextualize the movement on stage.
One of the biggest needs of the urban dancers was in Célestine’s portrayal the need to be authentic. In her experience with several productions she identified the pattern that the urban dance choreographers she worked with mostly chose topics that emerged out of their personal experiences. Often those topics had to do with the question of their personal identity. What was challenging in that work was to find the space where an audience could also relate to the personal topic.
Talk with Takao Baba
In my talk with Takao, urban dance based choreographer, organizer and dancer from Düsseldorf, on December 8th 2020 we talked mainly about his experience and working methods as a choreographer.
First of all explained that from his perspective the music and the sound system play a huge role in urban dance. Music needs to be played loud — the bass needs to be felt. It creates the hype, the atmosphere of an event — after a battle your ears need to beep.
Talking about the term urban dance he specified that the term is not right if you want to represent one of the individual dance styles that are put under this umbrella (like house dance, popping, breaking...). However this term fits if he works on stage since he doesn't use the pure dance styles but takes whatever serves the piece.
When developing choreography Takao mainly focuses on the topic of what he wants to work on and starts his movement research from there. That might produce material that could be placed in a traditional context but also material that is far away from that. The essence of his approach is in his words: The mind is Hip Hop and what comes out is what I feel.
As he described his approach to working he referred to Hip Hop and how it is based on sampling — rearranging what’s already there. He compares his practice to Bruce Lee’s Jeet Kune Do, a martial art that unites different martial arts and doesn’t separate. In order to keep his pieces exciting he uses a well portioned amount of entertainment.
The main strategy in terms of collaboration that Takao shares for creating choreographies is to try to establish material that everyone involved can identify with — if you feel good on stage you will shine. Concerning the choice of his dancers he mentions that stage work needs another kind of preparation than battling or preparing for jams and that not every dancer is ready for both environments.
He sees urban dance as a potential medium to bring people from diverse cultural backgrounds onto the stage and into the audience.
